lish their own foundation. A lot of artists have expressed the need to know more about fundraising and how to think about long term sustainability. Hope: That’s another aspect to this commit- ment to distributing power. White artists who move in circles of power and have relation- ships with funders, donors, and program offi- cers can directly connect those folks with art- ists. This is one way of bringing new voices to the table. Instead of saying, “I’ll get that grant for you,” say, “Meet this person, you can apply for this grant directly.” Sima: This sounds like a sideways movement. Unblocking access. Stepping aside rather than stepping down. Hope: I just published a blog post about step- ping back. White folks shouldn’t withdraw and disengage as a way of avoiding the structural work of antiracism. What does it mean to stay in the work while also making space for other voices? Sometimes it’s appropriate for white people to step away entirely and that might be what I do eventually, but I also feel like there has to be capacity building, a transitioning of relationships and resources, and an engage- ment in difficult conversations. Just saying “I’m out of here” may not always be the best thing
everyone that was there, but at least every- one’s perspectives are acknowledged, heard, and taken into account. More and more we’re starting from this place of dialogue, and more and more we’re able to because we’re building trust with artists. Hope: It’s interesting to think about the implications of distributed leadership work for art making. Many choreographers and directors claim to work collaboratively in the studio, but typically that ethos only goes so far. The pressures for authorship in the stu- dio are different than in administrative and institutional contexts. In antiracist and equi- ty-driven work, I don’t think we should let artmaking off the hook. Sima: It’s important to take the temperature on how local dance communities feel about your organization. Whether or when you can make a practical shift, if the community feels the organization is there for them, that’s a huge difference already. Hope: There are a lot of organizations doing surveys right now of their “community.” A survey’s good—it’s better than not doing a survey—but there’s a difference between having artists weigh in as some sort of ancil- lary unpaid or underpaid focus group, whose
Hope step back in a lot of ways—being more cautious about time, sharing decisions with Karla and me. I’ve even stepped back, just listening to the artists and what they need, rethinking curation and who that should come from. It’s been about sharing responsi- bilities and giving up power at times. Sima: In an older paradigm, I’d think it would be more efficient because you would delegate tasks. Karla: In particular when we’re talking about partnering with artists. It’s about providing the resources and information artists need to take ownership or leadership over something. If people don’t know the structure that’s cur- rently in place, where things come from and what the thinking is behind them, then it’s a really tall ask to say, do you want to share leadership over this. A lot of it is about how we communicate information with each other and the community. That’s where the focus of distributed leadership is right now. Also, it’s revealing that what is most scarce is our time. Hope: For me, distributed leadership is not just structural. It’s cultural. The culture of the organization needs to shift and that takes time. It’s about unpacking the layers of power. It’s about relationships. It’s about shifting how the organization relates to time, efficiency, and control. Those deeper organi- zational shifts get at white supremacist cul- ture, which pervades nonprofits and philan- thropy. Just changing who’s inside the system is not going to change that much. Sima: What can In Dance readers do to support HMD’s new adventures? Hope: We want to bring more working art- ists onto the board, so if people are interested in being a part of this work, reach out to us. Also, I’m interested in being in conversation with other organizations who are doing this work or navigating similar shifts. To normal- ize these shifts, I think it’s important that the learning doesn’t happen behind closed doors. We need to share our learning curves, our mistakes, and our vulnerabilities. Karla: We’re calling for organizations to be more transparent with the artists they work with. Cherie: We want people to check out Power Shift, The Bridge Project that’s coming up and join us. That’s a step toward engaging in equity and supporting diversity for our community in dance. People should read HMD’s blog. Folks have asked that we publicize our process and decisions more, so keep an eye out for that. Hope: It’s less efficient. Cherie: And more work. SIMA BELMAR, PH.D., is a Lecturer in the Depart- ment of Theater, Dance, & Performance Studies at the University of California, Berkeley, and the ODC Writer in Residence. To keep up with Sima’s writing please subscribe to tinyletter.com/simabelmar.
We want people to check out Power Shift , The Bridge Project that’s coming up and join us.
to do. In dance, there’s a dominant model: the founder starts the organization and puts their name on it and then all the programs are tan- gled up in the founder’s personality. It’s crucial to disentangle the cult of personality from the public programs. It’s crucial to separate curat- ing from the founder’s ego and lineage. Sima: So what’s the plan for the relationship between HMD and The Bridge Project? Hope: It’s a work in progress. Karla: I think people in general undervalue what it takes to build enough trust to get a bunch of people in a room to share how they think with each other, in particular when they’re coming from different places and backgrounds. The trust I’ve seen grow through the distributed leadership meetings with the community, between the organiza- tion and the artists we work with, and how it keeps growing, is a real tangible thing we’ve been striving for. The things that come from this place are reflective of equitable practice. Many programs that aim to advance cultural equity reflect a savior mindset: we are giving something over, or up, for you. This change we are seeking can’t start from this place. It has to start from a place of conversation and maybe what emerges from that doesn’t serve
input you cherry-pick according to your com- fort level, and actually bringing artists to the table and giving them a stake in the future of the organization. Sima: What I’m hearing about the definition of distributed leadership is inviting other people, more people, different people, large amounts of people to the table, even if it becomes harder to determine what everyone needs, and then the three of you are in constant communi- cation about the decisions you make based on those conversations. Is it that simple? Hope: No, I don’t think it’s that simple. I resist defining it. This work is emergent, itera- tive, and dynamic. And in our case it’s val- ue-driven. It’s not a business decision. We’re not doing this because I’m leaving town or I’m dead. The more we do, more reveals itself as needing to be done. Cherie: I agree. I don’t think we have a defi- nition yet because it’s still in process and we’re at the earlier stages of it. I think dis- tributed leadership in general is unique to whomever is doing it. I think the things you said are parts of it, at least where we are with it now. A year from now there could be a lot more components. I would also add that stepping back is a big part of it too. I’ve seen
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